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You can't change a 43-year old (40,173) by CHAZ from USA Mariah is Mariah. Is she gonna change? Heck no! The major problem with Mariah is her mentality that she's eternally 12. As far as her voice, do you sound like your voice 23 years ago? Thought so. It's only natural. Either you love her for what she is today, or you don't love her at all. Period. (Wednesday 11 December 2013; 11:11)

Re: Licia (40,172) by Billy from Greece Thanx Licia. I managed to find the picture after all. (Wednesday 11 December 2013; 8:31)

An excuse vs. a reason: do you know the difference? (40,171) by Lamb_O_Chop from Australia Since the "lame excuses" bandwagon is on a rise, I thought I'd raise a valid question. Do you understand the difference between someone making an excuse from someone giving a valid reason. Compare the definitions below: Reason, noun a statement presented in justification or explanation of a belief or action, the basis or cause for a belief or action. Excuse, noun a pretext or subterfuge, an explanation offered to justify or obtain forgiveness. So I ask, were members of this board "making excuses" for Mariah's bad performance or where they just merely "offering reasons" why Mariah's voice was in the condition it was in at the tree lighting performance? Ponder, sleep on it, even respond if you will. Or not. (Wednesday 11 December 2013; 3:53)

I love you Myles (40,170) by Joyce from USA Myles, you sound just like me. And it's nice to see more people listening to their ears and not being afraid to say, ummm that sucks rather than make excuses and trick themselves into thinking it was awsome. I think she should never use the words "moment" "festive" and "dahling", focus on on rehabilitating that voice, cut her hair to a classy bob do, or something totally new and fresh that doesn’t say cougar hair, step away from the usual and try something new. I think a few tracks composed by William Orbit but down tempo and very cutting edge or by Tosca, the music composing duo, would be new, cutting edge and new territory. But it seems she fears change at this stage. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 20:26)

I agree with all the critiques (40,169) by Kenny from Canada I agree with all the criticism that's been mentioned by everyone here. First, that her vanity is what is leading to her downfall. She seems like she wants so desperately to cling to that girly Barbie/Marilyn Monroe image that she's lost sight of what has drawn her fans to her in the first place - which is her musicality, passion and her voice. She's had the same look and style for so many years it's exasperating. She likes to squeeze into these tiny cleavage-baring outfits in -10 degree weather. And always, always... the long blonde hair. Ugh. Second, it's painful to watch and hear her perform live. If she has to lip synch she should just stop period and retire. I just watched clips of her performing WBT, Honey and It's Like That for the NY special and it just reaffirms all the points I made her. Also, why is she still singing these songs in 2013 instead of promoting new music? (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 17:01)

Mariah's voice (40,168) by Alex from England I can understand some people are scared Mariah will fade away into oblivion. But what you guys should realize is that even after the debacle that was Glitter and the breakdown moment (though I loved the album) when everyone was saying she is over, she is still here 12 years after that. Yes, she has issues with her voice, nothing new, it's been 15 years. Whether it is due to alcohol or not, I don't know and neither do you. All I know is Mariah's had bad performances here and there for more than a decade, but she's also had great ones (you know, the ones you watch and then you think "I'll never doubt Mariah's voice again"). Everytime she has a bad performance, I end up being still blown away by the next one. Mariah's voice has changed, we all know it. It's not about singing in the cold or all those lame excuses. Let's be real, there is another explanation whether it is because of her nodules flaring up or her not sleeping properly or drinking/eating the wrong things. Or even something we are not aware of. That being said, I wish people would just be a bit more supportive (while still being realistic) because I'm sure she sings the best she can on a given day, why wouldn't she? Sure I'd love for her to have that powerhouse voice she used to but she doesn't. All I know is her voice is touch and go and as a singer myself I can relate. Some days there is just no controlling my voice however bad I want to. Mariah, I love and support you no matter how good you sing next time. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 16:47)

The pregnant woman (40,167) by Edward from USA It is so weird that many female artist have reported bad voice changes while being pregnant, yet Mariah voice changed for the better. What wasn't Mariah doing during her pregnancy? Oh, she said herself she wasn't drinkng alcohol or even splashing at all. So, for those who prefer to be blinded by their own fanatism, it is ok, but for some people with objectivity and common sense it is evident that not-drinking was a huge factor. The pregnant woman was slaying her performances left and right, One Child in Washington was a vivid example of it. Is Mariah an alcoholic? Maybe not, but just like when she quit smoking to regain her range, she doesn't seem to want to give up her "splashes" that sometimes get her drunk. What will the excuses be when people start walking out of her future concerts like they did to Whitney? Oh, maybe it is because she is a mother and have family now, another excuse. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 16:35)

Her vanity got the best of her (40,166) by Myles from CT, USA I will always love Mariah, but the passion I used to feel for her is fading. Her vanity got the best of her. Remember when she put on a good show? Ran across the stage and sang her heart out? The energy she brought was magnificent. It was about the music then. Now it is about the right angle and the right dress. She just stands there and tries to sing as she once did. It depresses me. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 16:06)

MC (40,165) by Mimi L. from Empower Your Highlighter Mariah should really get into her TEOM mode. She promoted that album a lot! She did not start rambling on about random unrelated things during interviews. She gave some very memorable performances. She changed the songs here and there to adjust to her voice. A common example would be "We belong together". There are many changes she does to the song when she sings it live. That's great, I like it. She doesn't have to sing exactly like the studio version. Nowadays she keeps rambling during interviews, talking about her dog and champagne and camera angles even when the host themselves are trying to steer her towards related topics. Her performances haven't been great. It hurts me to see her go down like this. If she really wants to stay in the business she should get serious, and yes I think she is not being serious because it's a fact. Now people on this board may throw darts my way, I don't care. Someone needs to tell MC to get her act together, I don't want her to fade away. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 13:44)

Mariah's voice (40,164) by Stephen from London, United Kingdom If it looks like an orange, peels like an orange and even tastes like an orange, then call it a bloody orange. Mariah's voice has its good moments, but the bad moments are certainly outweighing the good. Some fans need to recognise that Mariah's voice is shot. There's no need for excuses. Bad is bad. Simple. Do I think it's the end for Mariah? No. She's a great songwriter and producer. If she lays off the alcohol, then who knows what may happen. At the moment though, taking care of her voice is clearly not a priority. Anyone for a "splash"?! (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 11:18)

Excuses, excuses (40,163) by Bill from the UK I think everybody is dancing around the obvious here. No "lamb" wants to admit it, but there is a very heavy suggestion that Mariah has a drinking problem. Her public appearances are very odd and the most telling sign is of course the state of her voice. There is absolutely no reason why she cannot sing well, because every so often she does a great performance. It is entirely self inflicted and if she was more responsible and stopped the daily "splashes" she'd be fine. Every singer in the world, except Mariah it would seem, knows alcohol is one of the worst things for your singing voice. If she wants to carry on then so be it, she can do what she wants, but please stop these lame half-baked excuses. Plenty of mediocre singers perform perfectly well in cold weather people! Singing for three minutes should be a walk in the park for a singer of Mariah's calibre. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 8:58)

Re: Licia (40,162) by jaker20 from US I did not say MC should never sing her old songs. I'm saying she needs to build a new discography that is more fitting to her current voice. And no one said it is going to be easy. We are all working and at some point in time we need to adjust to our new self. At some point in our lives we can't continue to work 12 hours a day, run like the wind and eat anything we want. Same with MC. She needs to adjust to her new self, otherwise, that's it. It's over. If she and her fans don't recognize this, she will not grow old gracefully because she'll be stuck in reminiscing her past glories. Like I said, it won't be easy. It might mean losing your old fans, maybe losing you and me. But for her as an artist, it is good. We all get old, but growing and learning never ends. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 8:35)

Marc Charles' analysis (40,161) by Jamie from UK I don't think Mark Charles' post was unnecessarily lengthy. If this was a forum, his analysis/theory should be in a sticky at the top for everyone wondering what happened to Mariah's voice. That topic is brought up again and again and again. I also think an upvote/downvote system would be cool for this message board. Anyone agree? (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 8:06)

Nobody comes close to MC (40,160) by Will from Australia So remember when Leona Lewis came on the scene and she was being heralded as the new new Mariah, before Grande. Well she just realised a Christmas album that I for one knew nothing about and it just happens to have three songs from Merry Christmas: O Holy Night, Christmas Baby Please Come Home and Silent Night. Silent Night is the only one that I can honestly say sounds good but the other two are so poor compared to Mimi's versions. Simon Cowell is still trying to mimic Mariah (remember he made Walter Afanesief an executive producer on Leona's debut album and wrote songs not too dismisliar to Music Box). I like Leona (her Ave Maria - is that even her wow) but it does make you admire more just how brilliant Mariah's versions are, aside from what everyone knows in AIWFCIY, the other efforts are untouchable from any female artist in my opinion. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 8:05)

Lee, Lamby from Hong Kong, Joyce (40,158) by Lamb_O_Chop from Australia Lee from the UK: Sugar sugar boo boo, my point still stands, many things the lambily mentioned in reference to Mimi's tree lighting performance weren't "unfounded excuses", but if you say no shade was intended then I digress. Lamby: Sweet potato, we don't know the details of what Mariah had to endure with Tommy. Even MJ said he was a , so it's not our place to tell her to "get over it already" or call her mean when we don't know all the facts. Letting go ain't easy baby. Also be careful with what you give Tommy credit for, because the Mariah we fell in love with wasn't Tommy's puppet, but was the result of Mariah fighting to add favor to her sound. It wasn't all Tommy, it was his guidance and Mariah creative instincts that created the artist we fell in love with. I believe if it was up to Tommy, we probably wouldn't have Daydream, or several of MC's biggest hits as well; instead we'd have several Music Boxes and she would still be stuck in the Whitney Celine clone status not how I wanna see my Mariah. So please stop giving him all that. As a matter of fact, I blame him for MC not having a balance now. Joyce: Mariah is not old, so you're right it's not age that affected her voice, evidently it's medical issues with her vocals chords due to many things already mentioned. Therefore you can't compare her vocal state to Celine, Barbra, Patty or whoever else's, because they don't have the same vocal chords or have the same vocal issues MC has. After finally seeing the performance, I think she just had an off day which could've been due to several factors, so I totally disagree with the individuals who believe that this is the best of MC's current vocal condition. If you believe that it is then you should refer to the camera phone video of her singing on Fallon, it gets no more undubbed than that. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 2:16)

How many years? / lame excuses (40,157) by Edward from USA How many years does Mariah need to rest her voice to be able to deliver a great performance? Mariah is a human being, I know that, but she is a singer by profession. Why do we have to hold on to our seats everytime she is going to sing live? Some even say that now she is a mother, well there are many mothers out there who have it worse than her. Instead of making lame excuses for her bad performances, I rather remain silent. Mariah has vocal chords issues, and she should find a way to deal with it. I hope she finds some sort of viable solution to enhance the state of her voice, since the new album is supposed to be full of old Mariah type of moments. She'll need to deliver should she want this new era to be good. We, fans alone, won't make a difference. She needs new fans, and to regain some of the lost ones should she want to have a record deal after this album. Sales like Memoirs won't cut it, since she isn't having multiple platinum singles like Rihanna, Katy Perry or Miley Cyrus. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 2:10)

Re: Lee from the UK (40,156) by Tory from Australia I agree with you 100%. No more excuses, this is not "hating" or "nitpicking". If you can't handle your loyal fans critique, how are you going to feel when the media is up your bum about it? Lol. I've had enough of the dubbing and blatant lipping, I just want Mariah to give us her all and give us the real deal. Whitney Houston didn't sound like she used to but she still got up and sang live infront of countless award and talent shows and no-one made a fuss about it. I still loved her comeback performances because even though the voice wasn't 100%, her energy and stage presence was above and beyond. Her performances were genuine and at the end of the day, that was most important. Mind you, she always had that "spark" and presence from the very beginning. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 1:43)

Who cares? It's not that deep (40,155) by clueey23 from USA So MC rushed on stage and was clearly out of breath, sounded great and then she didn't hit the falsetto notes. Hello, it's her falsetto. Look up falsetto and then maybe you would have a better understanding as to why she wasn't able to hit those particular notes that particular moment. Not to mention nodules on her vocal folds. I think MC sounds great regardless. And I wouldn't be surprised if she went backstage, took a sip of water and took a breath and hit the same notes that she didn't hit on stage. Maybe if I didn't sing and understand music, I would probably sound as critical and ignorant as some of you on this fan message board. I can't wait for the next performance, single and album. (Tuesday 10 December 2013; 1:02)

Lamb_O_Chop (40,154) by Lee from UK Honey, darling, I almost missed your attempt at condescension due to the unnecessarily lengthy post by Marc Charles. I think it may benefit you to re-read my previous post as, from what I can infer, you seem to have taken my words for an attack on Mariah. In actual fact they were more of a plea to those making unfounded excuses and calling them reason. (Monday 9 December 2013; 23:56)

Billy from Greece (40,153) by Licia from USA I have no idea where I got this pic from, but if you want to leave your email, I will send it to you. (Monday 9 December 2013; 23:20)

Mariah's voice (40,151) by Manny from U.S. With critical fans like the ones in this messageboard, Mariah does not need enemies. First of all, I'm not making excuse for her. There have been many singers that have problems with their voices (i.e. Julie Andrews, Whitney Houston, Steven Tyler, Shania Twain). Some people say she does not take care of her voice because she drinks. You guys make her out to be an alcoholic. Other people say she doesn't warm up or is more concerned about her looks. It can be other reasons we don't know about. There might me emotional reasons that might have to do with her voice's condition. When Shania Twain was on Oprah, she mentioned she was hiking through a hard part of her life and she couldn't sing. I just feel some fans are being really negative. She already said she does have nodules. Let's get more educated on what those are instead making Mariah out to be like a failure, mess, or has been. We should support her and be more positive. (Monday 9 December 2013; 23:00)

DC performance (40,150) by Stacey from USA What this performance proves is Mariah is human. Some days she is on, sounding great, and some days she is off. This was an off night. I'm sure haters will drag this out. But if anyone can bounce back, it's MC, especially during her favorite time of year: Christmas. I mean if the haters want to keep it going, all we have to do is play that impromptu performance on Fallon. (Monday 9 December 2013; 22:59)

Grammys (40,149) by Jeanette from USA I'm watching some of these older Grammys shows on YouTube and it amazed me that Whitney Houston and Celine Dion both have album of the year but Mariah Carey doesn't. The Grammys did Mariah dirty and she deserves to have at least won album of the year for Music Box or Daydream or even The Emancipation Of Mimi. What are your guy's thoughts? (Monday 9 December 2013; 22:30)

Tree lighting ceremony (40,148) by Ryan from Canada IMO this performance wasn't great but it wasn't as bad as reading this board makes it sound like it was. She sang well most of the song. It was the break in her high note at the end that sounded awful. Obviously it caught her with as much surprise as it did us. I'm sure she will rest her voice and sound fantastic for the New Year show. (Monday 9 December 2013; 20:42)

I could have done better (40,147) by Joyce from USA It seem like there is more physical exertion in singing these days than before. Her body posture, facial expression looks so strenuous. That is how I can tell when she is really singing live. When she lips, she has an easier time to focus on her appearance in her performance. My opinion is she really doesn’t get those vocal chords a workout as she use to. Though, she is much better than the time she tried to sing "I want to know what love is" on one of those morning shows in 2009. She needs a serious vocal work out. Celine, Barbra Striesand even Donna Summer before she died are older than MC and sound great. Before some fanatic says not to compare, know that I am not. I'm saying that age does not deteriorate vocals at MC young age or at least so drastically except if you don't use them enough. (Monday 9 December 2013; 20:12)

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