Messageboard | The Mariah Carey Archives

Only registrated members can post messages. Registration is free.

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,889) by Bobby A from United States

I am having a blast reading these posts. With my vacation coming to an end in two days, I need some laughter in my life. Cheers cheers to see what happens in 2026. I see a remix album coming this summer. Just kidding. Lol.

(Saturday 3 January 2026; 03:02)


this is a reply to message		112,887

MHWGO and My All video (112,888) by Dove from United States

Honestly, when I first saw that video, I thought maybe she - or whoever came up with the concept - was inspired by Titanic, too. That movie was huge back then. Although I love Celine's version, I would have loved to hear Mariah's interpretation of it.
(Saturday 3 January 2026; 01:42)

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,887) by Edward from USA

But you have to admit that the stuff some people pull out of their behinds, as ridiculous as it might sound, can be entertaining in times like these. I'm having a blast. I'm waiting for the reveal that the New Year's fiasco was just Tommy hitting mute from a control room.

(Saturday 3 January 2026; 01:29)


this is a reply to message		112,883

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,886) by Lambi from USA

No one is saying Mariah mocked Céline or made a parody video. The point is about extreme contrast, not shade. At the time, Sony was pushing huge, cinematic ballads like MHWGO. Very much Tommy-coded. Schmaltzy and corny. Same for the video.

Meanwhile Mariah was openly fighting for creative control. Choosing a dark, intimate, minimalist video for My All released right after MHWGO and using similar oceanic and tragic imagery, can reasonably be read as her saying, "This is actually how I want to do it." That's interpretation based on timing and industry context, not a conspiracy. It isn't completely far-fetched. It's ridiculous to willingly miss the broader point.

Will Mariah ever confirm this? Hell no. The same way she wouldn't confirm Eminem was the guy she dressed up as in Obsessed. The same way she would never confirm that the Honey video symbolizes how she was a hostage in Sing Sing. Mariah does subtext. If you refuse to read between the lines, that is your limitation.
(Saturday 3 January 2026; 00:57)


this is a reply to message		112,883

Divas Live 1998 (112,885) by Terna from Nigeria

There is a tendency for female singers to try and outdo or outsing each other once they're sharing a stage. Mariah is well aware of this fact and wanted no parts of any such setup. It always ends up as a screaming match and then the song gets butchered. Check the Aretha Franklin tribute by Yolanda, Martina, Christina etc. I'm glad Mariah, even though Aretha approached her to lift, did not engage. That was wisdom because you don't control what the other singers are going to do and then suddenly it's a screaming match, nothing musical, then the train gets derailed and all the divas fall off. Haha.
(Saturday 3 January 2026; 00:00)

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,884) by Dove from United States

I think he was trying to prove that he could make anyone a star and wanting to make Mariah feel like she wasn't as special as she thought she was. Just my guess though.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 23:36)


this is a reply to message		112,877

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,883) by jaker20 from US

This is the first time I'm reading this sort connection between My All video and MHWGO, it's just so ridiculous to think Mariah had a part in conceiving a clap back video, let alone to make fun of MHWGO.

For me, after Daydream, Mariah wanted to do something in the film industry because back then artists think movies is the next step. Whitney was doing what she saw herself doing next, that is, soundtracks for films she would star in. Whitney was just coming off Waiting to Exhale, and The Preacher's Wife, and by the time Butterfly was released, she was producing Cinderella, and probably thought she could do the same.

I can see Mariah being jealous of what Whitney was doing because as she wanted more control over the materials she's singing.

Does she want to be part of successful soundtracks she didn't write? Sure. But that's like saying, she was jealous of Alanis Morrisette for dominating the cross-over pop-rock scene at the same time Mariah was creatively and commercially peaking.

(Friday 2 January 2026; 20:04)

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,882) by Lighty from China

We don't know her.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 16:30)


this is a reply to message		112,880

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,881) by Edward from USA

I don't know her.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 15:57)


this is a reply to message		112,880

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,880) by Bill from the UK

Who's this J.Lo person you all keep talking about?
(Friday 2 January 2026; 15:34)


this is a reply to message		112,879

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,879) by MusicfanJ from Germany

I always liked Celine too. A smart, funny woman. Her music is pop and a bit of chanson but on a level which is really rare. She belongs to the "voice trinity" with Mariah and Whitney. J.Lo is so far away from it. She was never more than an entertainer/dancer. I don't know why Tommy helped her instead of another singer. Thalia at least seemed friendly and nice. Personally I can't stand J.Lo.

(Friday 2 January 2026; 14:28)


this is a reply to message		112,877

Christina Aguilera (112,878) by Lambi from USA

Christina was out of line, for sure. Mary J Blige said the same thing, "She stuck her hand out for me to kiss it," she tried to be slick. I did look into it though because I'm curious why she is this way.

Apparently Christina's father was physically and verbally abusive toward her mother. The girls, she has a younger sister, were always rendered powerless in the household. She was also bullied as a kid. Because she was undeniably beyond local level, Christina was targeted by other kids at school. Some competitors in talent shows reacted with envy and even vandalism, like slashing her mom's car tires.

So yeah, I think just years of verbal abuse, instability, and torment that inevitably shaped her arrogance. It became her defense mechanism. I also think The All-New Mickey Mouse Club heightened it. On a show filled with teenagers that sold talent, they all subconsciously wanted to be the most talented, in front of national television. She basically just had the worst formative years as a performer. It's similar to Mariah's but at least MC got to laser focus on developing her talents as a teenager privately, without the immense pressure of being on TV. That would mess anyone up.

I'll give her some grace, but I still don't know that she really possesses that golden voice standard. Even today, it irks me when she does interviews and says, "You know, as a powerhouse vocalist," like why would you self-proclaim that. LMAO.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 13:50)


this is a reply to message		112,875

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,877) by Mimi L. from Empower Your Highlighter

I really would like to know Tommy's thought process when he thought JLo could be the new Mariah? The woman doesn't write, nor does she sing (won't even get into her range, she can't sing point blank), doesn't produce. She's basically an entertainer with a pretty face. If you're going to try to replace a once in a lifetime phenomenon like Mariah, you need to put your money where your mouth is and match her skill for skill. I always found it sad that Mariah dissed Céline so much. Céline is so sweet and always has nice things to say about others.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 13:39)


this is a reply to message		112,873

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,876) by Lambi from USA

Sorry, but I just had a family member that was obnoxious. I'd say yeah, I took out the chicken and started thawing it around 3pm. And she would be like, "Nu-uh, you took it out when I got home at 2:45," when it's already 8pm and the chicken is ready to cook no matter what anyway. LMAO. I am very short-fused with this.

Fair point about My All. It could very much be because Titanic was so massive and everywhere at the time. Mariah was genuinely inspired by it and just liked the aesthetic of the over turned boat submerging in the ocean. I don't know though. Part of me also believes she's genuinely irked with Céline because she got all the special treatment from Sony. To me, it was like Tommy saying to Mariah, "This is what you could've had if you just listened," and after reading Tommy's memoir, it confirmed it even more for me.

Walters' account also somewhat confirmed it. He said, "Singers like Mariah, Celine, Whitney, Barbra, they're all very insecure creatures. If you start working on a song with another singer, the jealousy comes out. They're very, very jealous people." He is so messy, but I believe it. I grew up in the performing arts and the best talents always trashed each other behind the scenes.

But yeah, at least Céline was actually a formidable competition vocally. Post-Sony, them drumming up the narrative that JLo was her rival was so insulting. They caricatured the heck out of Mariah. "This is your equivalent now. You're rendered to a talentless bimbo."
(Friday 2 January 2026; 13:03)


this is a reply to message		112,873

Christina Aguilera (112,875) by Dove from United States

I don't see her as a competitor. (Céline, yes.) I used to kind of like Christina when I was younger, but now every time I try to listen to her, it sounds like nails on a chalkboard.

The audacity she had to run her mouth about Mariah when she (Christina) was first starting out is unbelievable. She was super rude to contestants as a judge on The Voice too. I think she's even said negative things about Britney. Her mean-girl attitude is the final nail in the coffin for me. Her ego outweighs her talent.

I know people say that about Mariah now that her voice is not what it used to be but I don't see it the same. At one point Mariah's voice was magic and otherworldly. Legendary, even.

Also, I feel like Mariah only shades people who come for her first, and even then it's mild. She doesn't go after people just to be cruel.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 12:18)

Nah (112,874) by Lambi from USA

Mariah was deeply embarrassed. Aretha hand-picked her for that moment, but it was Céline who ultimately gave Aretha that moment. The entire world saw it. Mariah's reaction was hilarious when Céline finally accepted the challenge in Testimony. Mariah plays it off like she did it out of respect, but we could also argue that it's disrespectful to decline the clear invitation from Aretha.

Now imagine if Whitney had been there, or Gladys Knight, or Chaka Khan. They would have done the same thing because that's what church-bred gospel singers do. They ascend together and revel in each other's talent when they're anointed. There's obviously no hint of disrespect in that exchange.

There's another layer to consider. That night, Carole King was Céline's personal guest. During Natural Woman, she was supposed to open the song, but Aretha sang over her and took her part. It wouldn't surprise me if Céline was a little irritated by that, because she spent the rest of the night going toe-to-toe with Aretha and held nothing back.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 12:12)


this is a reply to message		112,870

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,873) by Lighty from China

I only corrected those "insignificant technicalities" because those were the only things that were, well, technically wrong. Maybe I should've studied law and become a lawyer as Bobby A said. Just kidding.

I said I mostly agree with you on this topic and I truly meant it, expect for, maybe the My All video part. Everyone can have their own interpretation of a music video and that's fine.

Well back to this topic, I always had this feeling that Mariah treat other female singers in distinctively different attitudes: respect the senior divas (Aretha, Patti, Whitney, etc.); friendly to the industry recognized divas (Janet, Mary J, Beyonce, etc.); indifferent or somewhat bitter towards some of the vocal powerhouses (Celine, Christina Aguilera, etc.); acknowledging some younger generations depending on whether she "knows" them or not (Rihanna, Ariana, Taylor, etc.); and somewhat hostile towards certain ones (Madonna, JLo, etc.).

The difference between Celine and JLo is that Celine had the voice, the hits, the sales that might've threatened Mariah during a certain period, so I think Mariah more or less treated her as a competitor more than just a label mate. Meanwhile JLo, quote Mariah, "Her thing is something different". She was like Tommy's weapon to take Mariah down with the Firecracker sample and Ja Rule feature incidents. It is natural that Mariah treated her as the "thief" for stealing her most cherished thing, which is music and songwriting.

At the end of the day, Mariah never really spoke ill of Celine except for maybe that Divas Live thing. But for JLo, Mariah will never know her.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 11:44)


this is a reply to message		112,868

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,872) by Bobby A from United States

This conversation is very interesting. It is like watching two lawyers battle in the courtroom.

(Friday 2 January 2026; 10:56)


this is a reply to message		112,868

Nah (112,871) by Dove from United States

I don't think I even noticed the drama when I first watched it. I thought maybe they rehearsed it that way. I was surprised none of the other ladies went harder. I used to listen to the CD a lot back then and I appreciated Celine's contributions on the whole album. You can show what you've got and still be respectful, I think.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 10:49)


this is a reply to message		112,863

Nah (112,870) by Bill from the UK

It's weird because I also watched DL on its original air date (and recorded to video the undubbed original version - where Aretha's performance of A Rose Is Still A Rose is not cut and Carole's mic isn't muted during Natural Woman). I remember feeling there was something "off" with Mariah's voice, I put it down to tiredness at the time, but it was more raspy and gritty than ever. The touched up DVD/CD version sounds a lot better but the actual vocals on the night seemed like every note was a struggle and effort, which was never the case previously.

And as for the finale with Celine. All I remember is being annoyed that Aretha walked over to Mariah, put her arm around her, brought her to the stage, and *invited Mariah to sing with her* and Mariah said "Jesus" three times then stepped back. Obviously Mariah knew she couldn't compete and after a night of singing in a relatively bad form, probably couldn't handle it. I don't buy this whole "I was respecting the queen" line she spews out every time it's mentioned.

I also think Celine was gracious in her behaviour, as Aretha was clearly asking the singers to "help her lift it" and none of them did. Céline saw Aretha originally picked Mariah, who shrank back, and only after seeing Mariah not do anything did she step in to not leave Aretha hanging. She was the only one capable that night, vocally speaking, of matching Aretha's energy and power. We need to be real and face facts. This whole "Celine was disrespectful" narrative has got to end. She was doing what she was paid to do that night and what Aretha was asking one of the singers to do.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 10:42)


this is a reply to message		112,863

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,869) by Lambi from USA

I was speaking metaphorically. Mariah took the Titanic-esque elements in her My All music video, with the overturned boat, isolated and alone in the vast ocean, very much like Rose in the movie. She did it in a more refined aesthetic way. It's kind of her way of showing Céline how it's done because the MHWGO music video came across as cringe.

I also agree about Divas Live. Aretha clearly just wanted to sing with Mariah, which made Mariah feel very special, but when it came time to help Aretha lift it at the end, only Céline rose to the challenge and completely owned it. She did absolutely nothing wrong. She hit the same notes she hits in every live performance, and this time Aretha happened to be there. Mariah didn't have access to those high belts and reacted bitterly.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 10:41)


this is a reply to message		112,857

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,868) by Lambi from USA

Yeah, it's your default to only correct the most insignificant technicalities. It's fair to bring up and I appreciate being corrected too, but at the very least acknowledge the broader points, otherwise you're inevitably going to come across as obnoxious. TJ did a great job by raising something he felt was slightly inaccurate while also adding depth and genuinely enriching the topic.
(Friday 2 January 2026; 10:26)


this is a reply to message		112,867

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,867) by Lighty from China

And by the way I think you're mixing up MHWGO and The Power of the Dream. MHWGO was written by James Horner and Will Jennings and the soundtrack version was produced by Horner and Simon Franglen while the album version was produced by Walter, if that's the situation you were talking about.

Meanwhile, The Power of the Dream was written and produced by David Foster, Linda Thompson and Babyface. There was only one version of this song, no difference between the version Celine sang at the Olympics and album version. David Foster was even playing the piano behind her at the Olympics Games ceremony.

I don't mean to be nitpicking, it's just some clarification of facts. If that annoys you, I should rest my case now.

(Friday 2 January 2026; 05:41)


this is a reply to message		112,860

Was Celine the original JLo? (112,866) by Stacey from USA

Exactly. It was a hard pill for me to swallow. I had to resolve my expectations for MC's music vs Mariah's new direction. I found myself having to accept MC's new direction Butterfly onward and find my beauty within that direction. So while an album like Glitter isn't my fancy, man I'm glad she made it because we got a song like Lead the Way.

(Friday 2 January 2026; 03:42)


this is a reply to message		112,856

Happy New Year (112,865) by Edward from USA

Happy New Year to my MCArchives family. Eric, 28 effing years, impressive. Thanks for keeping the site running for so long.

(Friday 2 January 2026; 03:42)

MORE MESSAGES